The Grouch Reads

I've started reading an essay by Terry Penner, "Socratic Ethics: Ultra-Realism, Determinism, and Ethical Truth"...

I've not finished it, but I can't resist sharing this passage from the latter part of the paper.
In it Penner is responding to someone who complains that on his account of Socratic thought there is nothing recognizably moral. (Readers of this blog might recall that I've alluded to remarks of the linguist Wierzbicka on the conceptual primacy of good/bad over 'right/wrong'.....I should not say that her views are identical with either Penner or Socrxates; nonetheless there's something interesting there.)

Here is part of Penner's response:

"Socrates and a tiny band of followers aside, no one is content to resort to the Socratic device of intellectual discussion to change people's views as to what it is good for them to do. We 'don't have the time' for that sort of thing. So instead--starting with Plato and Aristotle--we try to train people's characters by conditioning, using the devices of reward and punishment. ('What would happen if you allowed to people to do that? We've got to forbid it and back that prohibition by punishment.') ..."

Penner goes on to say that this system--promulgated by "leaders of family, society, and a legal system" persists in the face of "obvious failures".

And I wonder now about the Buddhist who once suggested that people feel a need for punishment because they start with self-hatred.... a fear that within one's breast there may be uncontrollable forces?

Post-script added
31 September
Is it just cowardice of I don't try to explain to my boss that s/he is confused about basic things? I have some doubts here. Most bosses/managers/supervisors are not very interested in hearing something new. At any rate, that has been my experience. They won't make you drink hemlock, but they will fire you or fail to renew your contract. (After all, that's one good reason for having an institution like tenure....) Can I resort to Socratic conversation with a boss and live to tell about it?--or escape firing?